FRM May2012 L1 exam feedback
- Thread starter AG
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Aleksander Hansen
Well-Known Member
A breach would be to take a picture of the actual exam and post it.
I don't see how discussing and comparing answers would be a breach of anything.
Aleksander Hansen
Well-Known Member
How would you decide what constitutes a harder question? That few people solved it? But that might also be attributed to some people not getting that far, while others jump back and forth. I would be surprised if the questions were not equally weighted as it would introduce a whole new level of exam strategy: find the 'hardest' questions, spend a lot of time on them and just mark off randomly everything else.
Curving based on individual questions makes no sense whatsoever.
@Robert: thank you so much for your generous feedback. I shared it specifically with our new site consultant (as I think Q&A is the key to our future; and brief video). Thank you so much for taking your time to write a long post!
@rony_frm: I think the cutoff is currently unknowable to anyone. The cutoff will be some ratio (percentage) of the top 5%; i.e., not the 5% quantile itself but some ratio of it. (I always sort of liked this because it implies the exclusion of the likely tiny handful of extreme outliers who may have absolutely aced the exam). From the feedback I read (across multiple sources, not just BT forum), I perceive more "pain" than the average historical pain. So, anecdotally, 2012 May P1 feels like it was tougher than historical average. There is always headache/heartache about the difficulty, but it is sounding so far a notch more difficult this round (or, maybe social media is merely more amplifying, come to think of it?). I don't think GARP's methodology has changed, here is what i wrote in January about it, and why the "cutoff" is not currently knowable :
@aman241: In regard to "People here are sharing too much information about exam , is that not a breach of exam privacy policy of GARP?" Thank you for your support in our helping to maintain the ethics of the forum (I think that is a necessary ingredient to the overall quality).
It appears that, as usual, Aleskander is generally correct. I am awaiting permission from GARP to publish the full guideline, and as soon as possible, we will be vetting the extant threads to ensure compliance (i.e., my plan, if we see a complete "word-for-word replication [stem plus answers]" is to merely give a soft edit with minimal loss of meaning). Here is a snippet of the guidance I've received (I don't think Kristina will mind me sharing the essence):
@rony_frm: I think the cutoff is currently unknowable to anyone. The cutoff will be some ratio (percentage) of the top 5%; i.e., not the 5% quantile itself but some ratio of it. (I always sort of liked this because it implies the exclusion of the likely tiny handful of extreme outliers who may have absolutely aced the exam). From the feedback I read (across multiple sources, not just BT forum), I perceive more "pain" than the average historical pain. So, anecdotally, 2012 May P1 feels like it was tougher than historical average. There is always headache/heartache about the difficulty, but it is sounding so far a notch more difficult this round (or, maybe social media is merely more amplifying, come to think of it?). I don't think GARP's methodology has changed, here is what i wrote in January about it, and why the "cutoff" is not currently knowable :
@aman241: In regard to "People here are sharing too much information about exam , is that not a breach of exam privacy policy of GARP?" Thank you for your support in our helping to maintain the ethics of the forum (I think that is a necessary ingredient to the overall quality).
It appears that, as usual, Aleskander is generally correct. I am awaiting permission from GARP to publish the full guideline, and as soon as possible, we will be vetting the extant threads to ensure compliance (i.e., my plan, if we see a complete "word-for-word replication [stem plus answers]" is to merely give a soft edit with minimal loss of meaning). Here is a snippet of the guidance I've received (I don't think Kristina will mind me sharing the essence):
Aleksander Hansen
Well-Known Member
I have no facts to back this up, but my guess, based on how they calculate the passing score, the number of people who historically sit the exam, and the percentage that tend to pass is that:
Those making 75% or more pass.
For a particularly difficult exam, I could see this drop to around 72%, and for an easy exam, rise to around 80%
Those making 75% or more pass.
For a particularly difficult exam, I could see this drop to around 72%, and for an easy exam, rise to around 80%
@Aleks, albeit without solid facts, that feels about right. I can't see how it could be higher than 75% or 80%, only about there or lower. thanks,
Aleksander Hansen
Well-Known Member
@David,
I also think the following heuristics hold:
1) P(Pass | Active on BT) >= P(Pass)
2) P(Pass | Worry about score, Peruse forum a lot/confirmation bias) >= P(Pass)
3) P(My silly comments making anyone feel better until July 6th) = 0 @ 99%
I also think the following heuristics hold:
1) P(Pass | Active on BT) >= P(Pass)
2) P(Pass | Worry about score, Peruse forum a lot/confirmation bias) >= P(Pass)
3) P(My silly comments making anyone feel better until July 6th) = 0 @ 99%
Aleksander Hansen
Well-Known Member
One interesting question which would affect the outcome is whether "no shows" get graded and included with score zero on the curve. After all, they fail, but in order to fail, their exam must be counted as 'fail' but in counting the exam as fail you would need to include it in the curving sample... Sort of like survivorship bias....
My guess is the passing score will be around ~70%, that seems the barrier for tests like these.
The exam was certainly harder than I anticipated. It was tougher than any of the three levels of the CFA program. Certainly not as wide, but deeper. And there were not as many 'easy' questions on this exam, and the more difficult questions required more steps. Now granted I didn't study as much as in the CFA program, but I doubt my view of the relative difficulty would change much. Now I screwed up somewhat because I couldnt' see the forest from the trees. Basically I got caught up in learning more about things that were more applicable to my job, as well as what I perceived as more important. So I definitely let out a little chuckle on the Kidder question. Certainly my bad.
My guess for my score: I was pretty darn sure on 50 of the questions, lets say I got 90% of those right. On 20 questions lets say I was pretty sure, but I could have made an error (rounding, stupid mistake, etc). Lets say I got 75% of those right. Now on another 20 questions or so, I probably narrowed it down to 2 answers and a good feeling on one of those, lets say I got 60% of those right. I know I missed 3 questions for sure. So for the remaining 7, lets say I could toss out a choice or I had an "educated" guess, lets say I got 35% of those right. That puts me right around 75%. As usual, it comes down to the guessing gods.
I mentioned roundings...GARP needs to do something to solve this. A good handful of times I was 'close' to the right answer and I was pretty sure it was due to rounding. However, it caused quite a bit of second guessing, re-checking, etc. IMO, in the era of calculators there is no need to do any rounding. Just store the bits of pieces of your question.
The exam was certainly harder than I anticipated. It was tougher than any of the three levels of the CFA program. Certainly not as wide, but deeper. And there were not as many 'easy' questions on this exam, and the more difficult questions required more steps. Now granted I didn't study as much as in the CFA program, but I doubt my view of the relative difficulty would change much. Now I screwed up somewhat because I couldnt' see the forest from the trees. Basically I got caught up in learning more about things that were more applicable to my job, as well as what I perceived as more important. So I definitely let out a little chuckle on the Kidder question. Certainly my bad.
My guess for my score: I was pretty darn sure on 50 of the questions, lets say I got 90% of those right. On 20 questions lets say I was pretty sure, but I could have made an error (rounding, stupid mistake, etc). Lets say I got 75% of those right. Now on another 20 questions or so, I probably narrowed it down to 2 answers and a good feeling on one of those, lets say I got 60% of those right. I know I missed 3 questions for sure. So for the remaining 7, lets say I could toss out a choice or I had an "educated" guess, lets say I got 35% of those right. That puts me right around 75%. As usual, it comes down to the guessing gods.
I mentioned roundings...GARP needs to do something to solve this. A good handful of times I was 'close' to the right answer and I was pretty sure it was due to rounding. However, it caused quite a bit of second guessing, re-checking, etc. IMO, in the era of calculators there is no need to do any rounding. Just store the bits of pieces of your question.
I think ur calculation is flawed - how can you calculate this on an absolute basis - what David and Aleks were talking about was in terms of percentile - i.e - taking a cut off the top 5% assume the top 5% figure came as 90 / 100 - so the benchmarks becomes 90 marks. Then GARP decides on the a specific X% off the top 5% - i.e X% off 5% - that X can be anywhere from 70% - 80%
Your approximation of 75% out of 100 in absoulute terms is too liberal
I easily got around 10 question wrong (maybe a few more) in my level 1 - and also missed out on attempting 3 questions - but still scored 1st quartile on all sections - how is that possible with the assumptions you made?
My assumption is based off my experience with the CFA exams. Similar pass rate, similar quality of candidates and the min passing score can be around 65-75, probably moreso on the lower end.
Hi,
From my experience as FRM Holder I can say that with 70 you are sure to pass and that with minimum of 63 (my assumption), you have some chances to pass too (I've written some FRM1 sample exams and got 62, 65 as scores. I think that I have realized the same score in the real exam) -> The top 5% should have an average score of 85-90. You take 75% of these scores and you are in the pass score range 63-67
From my experience as FRM Holder I can say that with 70 you are sure to pass and that with minimum of 63 (my assumption), you have some chances to pass too (I've written some FRM1 sample exams and got 62, 65 as scores. I think that I have realized the same score in the real exam) -> The top 5% should have an average score of 85-90. You take 75% of these scores and you are in the pass score range 63-67
nageshtheone
Member
Sir, could you please share the links of other forums/sources that you have visited. I have been unable to find any forums other than BT , pagalguy.com and linkedin.
Hi nageshteone,
In addition to yours (note that linkedin is not one source but several), there are
In addition to yours (note that linkedin is not one source but several), there are
- http://www.analystforum.com
- facebook (in particular GARP's own page),
- I also check our affiliate's forum @ www.edupristine.com (although I don't think it gave me any recent data points, I think it's new and early in its growth)
I think there may be away to find out if you passed today... If you go to the GARP website (without logging on) then attempt to register, you will see a message saying... you need to be logged on to register - logon as yourself -then you will find yourself taken directly to the registration page..... By checking what exams you are eligible to take – that gives an indication whether you have passed or not.
I for example was only allowed to register for part I or Part I&II together which would suggest I have not. This may be a software bug and mean nothing but if someone tries it and finds they can only register for part II that would suggest it may be so.
I for example was only allowed to register for part I or Part I&II together which would suggest I have not. This may be a software bug and mean nothing but if someone tries it and finds they can only register for part II that would suggest it may be so.
Hi Pojo - that tricked worked well till last year - they have fixed this bug now - and everyone who registered and have taken the exam is provided with the following message
Thank you for trying to register for the FRM / ERP Exam. Because you registered for the same Exam and the 2012 Exam results have not yet been released, we cannot allow you to register for the FRM / ERP Exam at this time. Once the results are published on July 6,2012 at that time you will be allowed to register for November 17, 2012 Examination.
Thank you for trying to register for the FRM / ERP Exam. Because you registered for the same Exam and the 2012 Exam results have not yet been released, we cannot allow you to register for the FRM / ERP Exam at this time. Once the results are published on July 6,2012 at that time you will be allowed to register for November 17, 2012 Examination.
Hi Member, That maybe so but I was just able to do it 30 min's ago, the trick is not to be logged on to the site when you try to register, as I said you then get a message saying you need to be logged on, then when you login - it throws you directly into the registration page (bypassing the error message you refer to) where you can see which exams you are eligible to register for.
Ok .. I haven't tried that trick yet .. but there is not guarantee that they have updated the databases with the results yet - so ppl who appeared for Level II will still show as eligible to register for Level II and ppl who appeared for Level I will still show as elligible to register for Level I and Level II both - so no guarantee if the results have been updated in the database yet - last year it was not until the one day before that it gave you accurate results
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